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User talk:Supuhstar

Welcome

Hi, welcome to My Little Pony Friendship is Magic Wiki! Thanks for your edit to the Derpy Hooves page.

Before you begin glance over the guidelines.

Please leave a message on my talk page if I can help with anything! -- McClaw (Talk) 16:48, April 24, 2011

Citations

Hi Supuhstar! Welcome to the wiki! We do things a little differently from Wikipedia around here. For one thing, we allow original research, and practically the entire wiki is original research. Another prominent difference is the citation method. There is currently one in-line citatiom in the entire wiki. If content requires citation, ask about it in the comment section. The first part of the paragraph you inquired about has a reference in the gallery, where it is written almost word for word by the show's developer and executive producer, Lauren Faust. The second part was stated by one of the show's directors, and I will promptly put up a reference. Please don't hesitate to ask me anything. -Throwawaytv 17:03, April 24, 2011 (UTC)

...and here you go. -Throwawaytv 17:22, April 24, 2011 (UTC)
Hey, thanks. I assumed you did stuff differently, and I like that. In fact, I normally don't have citations on my wikis. I just read that and I immediately thought "Cool story, bro", especially since it was in a section titled "Official information". I simply wanted to be absolutely sure that it was all true. I hope you understand. ~Kyli* 15:51, April 28, 2011 (UTC)

CSS vs. SVG

The problem using the CSS to transform the text is that it is not guaranteed to give a reliable result across all browsers. For example, here, the CSS text is not aligned properly (The vertical transformation doesn't work at all on IE8). I wouldn't mind which we used if the alignment was correct, but at the moment, only the SVG will display properly on all browsers. --Callofduty4 19:33, September 30, 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for pointing that out! It looks fine in IE 10, so I never would have known. I'll get right on that :3 ~Kyli* 20:50, October 1, 2011 (UTC)
I've fixed rendering on IE 8+. Tell me what you think! ~Kyli* 21:02, October 1, 2011 (UTC)
And I've fixed rendering on Webkit. I haven't got Firefox on my desktop, but I'll test that, soon ~Kyli* 22:44, October 1, 2011 (UTC)
And now it works on Mozilla browsers! I think that about covers it :3 ~Kyli* 06:01, October 2, 2011 (UTC)
Sorry, still broken in latest Firefox. The hidden underline shows up under the text and that we do not want. --Kinrah 21:29, October 23, 2011 (UTC)
A few things: First of all, who're "we"? If you're going to say that we don't want something, but I'm fine with it, you have to specify who "we" are. Second, why is it bad to have a link underlined; Isn't that the way it's always been done? I see no rendering problem using Firefox/Aurora, so I'm disinclined to think that it's "broken" for Mozilla browsers. I'll look for a solution, but so long as Wikia's CSS forces <a> links to be underlined, I really don't think there's a way to change that. If you have a solution, i'd be glad to hear it, but when it comes to practicality, pure text works better than SVG for many reasons, including accessibility by those with screenreaders and the ability to copy the text directly from the page. ~Kyli* 23:36, October 23, 2011 (UTC)
First off: I have no idea why I typed 'we'. Second, what I meant was, the hyperlink is activating on the underline even when the mouse isn't over the actual text in the column. For example, when I look at Big McIntosh's entry on the list, if I move my mouse to the middle of the word 'Earth' it catches the 'Stallion' link instead. The link underlines overlap into the columns on either side. --Kinrah 00:57, October 24, 2011 (UTC)
Interesting. That looks like Mozilla expanded the hitbox of the link horizontally. I'll look into it. ~Kyli* 02:22, October 24, 2011 (UTC)
I think you better hold off using non-standard CSS and style soup until there's a practical advantage to not using {{Hiddentext}}. –Throwawaytv 10:31, October 24, 2011 (UTC)
I'm sure you think I made a rash decision about this. However, I proposed the change back in September (over a month ago) and got absolutely no formal objection (only comment was "SVG looks 20% cooler"). More than this, I have, in fact, weighed the benefits and costs of the two methods:
Advantages of using this CSS:
  • Screen-readers and other accessibility programs have no problem reading the text
  • You can select and copy the text
  • Developers can see what it would look like with different text much more simply
  • Text can be modified much more easily
  • Text can be translated by browsers and other translators
  • Almost exactly the same code as the SVG file, but smaller, thus saving drive space and loading time (browser doesn't have to cache an image)
Advantages of using an SVG image:
  • Easier to code from a wiki standpoint
  • Same on outdated browsers
Your immediate, unquestioning reversion of my long-thought-out, announced, and effortful contributions not only feels unprofessional (from the standpoint of a regular Wikipedian contributor and Wiki founder), but also a bit rude. I would have preferred that you consult me or at least warn me of your actions to give me some time to argue my point in making such a change. However, seeing as you have the right to do so, I will not try to change it back without permission, but I just want it to be know that my actions thus far feel like they will not be tolerated, and I, personally, feel unwelcome in this wiki. ~Kyli* 21:37, October 24, 2011 (UTC)

Heartstrings/Lyra

Why do you want to move the name so badly to the top? It's not official, and the reference doesn't pertain to her name, it pertains to the t-shirt, so the reference at the top would make no sense. Lord of Shadows Words mean nothing! 06:05, November 21, 2011 (UTC)

The point of a wiki is to document things. If it's not as broad as Wikipedia, then it's to document very specific things. In this case, we are documenting My little Pony: Friendship is Magic, a TV show based on a line of toys by Hasbro. These toys would cease to exist if there was not a fan base of people to buy them. This makes the fan base the top most important part of the My Little Pony series. If we are to be a proper wiki and document My little Pony: Friendship is Magic, then we must also document the fan base which keeps it alive. This includes documenting how and why the fan base refers to each character, setting, plot, et cetera. In the case of Heartstrings, the fan base has, does, and will continue to prefer to call her either "Lyra" or "Lyra Heartstrings". Since this is the case, and it is identifiable by looking at any major publication which mentions the character, then this wiki must document that the fan base often calls this character "Lyra" or "Lyra Heartstrings". I used the link to Know Your Meme because it is the largest third-party source for the name that I can find other than Equestria Daily. I used the link to WeLoveFine because that is the largest second-party source I can find, and the contents of the page indicate that the character on the product being sold is named "Lyra", due to the fact that the product is called "Lyra On My Pocket", and there is only one pocket and one character on the product. ~Kyli* 06:18, November 21, 2011 (UTC)
I don't disagree about wiki's documenting information. However, this wiki is about the show. We take the show as top priority. When the show doesn't give us the information we need, we go to Hasbro, the owner and proprietor. If that fails, we go to the crew, then other sources, etc. (seems vaguely familiar). Now, about the information talking about how the "fanbase supersedes everything", it doesn't. Not at all. I'll give you an example as to why this is. Take Pokemon as the example:
  • The show presents an unknown Pokemon.
  • In response, the fanbase calls it "Trecado".
  • Nintendo releases a toy for this unknown Pokemon and names it "Jorpal".
Who is more right? The fanbase or Nintendo? Of course Nintendo, since they own the show, and the fanbase is just the fanbase.
The point of the matter is, fans want the name Lyra because they created it. This wiki is not telling them not to call her Lyra, but to say that "Heartstrings" is her official name until proven otherwise by the show. Lord of Shadows Words mean nothing! 06:31, November 21, 2011 (UTC)
I think you misinterpreted my intentions. I am not saying that the article, Hasbro, or the show is wrong by any stretch (If I was, I'd've moved the article and changed all instances of "Heartstrings" to "Lyra"). My edits do not contradict that Heartstrings is her official name, and they do not suggest that one mustn't call her that, but instead give some insight as to why so many people are calling this character, who is clearly named "Heartstrigs", "Lyra". The purpose of all wikis is to document information so that it may inform anyone who reads it, and all I am trying to do with the article is inform them as to why "Lyra" redirects to this page, why every time they see this character presented by the fandom, it is called "Lyra" instead of "Heartstrings", and to generally clear up confusion for the target audience of this article (that audience being someone who has come to seek information on the subject character).~Kyli* 06:37, November 21, 2011 (UTC)
But we already have two parts of the article that talk about the fanbased name. It doesn't need to be moved to the top. Lord of Shadows Words mean nothing! 06:45, November 21, 2011 (UTC)
This is where I believe you're wrong, my friend. I have been editing and moderating wikis since 2003, and I know that people need to be told, before the first section, what all the other common names for the article's subject are. For instance, take the Wikipedia article on astronomical auroras. Before the first section, it names, in bold, all the names that the phenomenon is commonly known by: aurora, aurora borealis, northern lights, Dance of the Spirits, aurora australis, and southern lights. This is, by far, NOT the only instance of this, as we can see it in several articles such as Hair tie, which states within the first sentence that it is also known as a ponytailer, ponytail holder, and hair band, or their article for computer monitors, where they state that it is also called a display, screen, and visual display unit. They do this because there is a wide host of people who could be looking at the article, and each one might be looking for it under a different name, and they all deserve to know, without having to dig through the meat of the article, why they call it one thing and the article calls it another. Again, I turn back to the article in question. Heartstrings is a perfectly fine name to know her by, and there will be some people who go here by searching "Heartstrings", wanting to know more about her, and they might find, deep within the article, that she's also called Lyra. However, people who search "Lyra" and get Heartstrings might be confused and skim the article looking for why "Lyra" redirected them there, and possibly even go so far as to create a new article titled "Lyra" because they think this wiki has no information on her. The point of placing the other popular names of the article subject before the first section is to ensure the reader that they are in the right place, and that this article knows what it's talking about and not calling the subject the wrong thing.~Kyli* 07:20, November 21, 2011 (UTC)
Please see Wikipedia:Common_name#Common_names for the proper way to reference a common name. Fan-sites and second-party merchandise do not qualify as references for common names. –Throwawaytv 07:41, November 21, 2011 (UTC)
I'm... not sure what you are trying to say, here. By what that says, the title of the article should be "Lyra", as it is "the most common name for a subject", and is therefore "recognizable and natural". Reading further down the passage, "Lyra" is also "the name that is most frequently used to refer to the subject in English-language reliable sources", as "Heartstrings" is only used once, on cards in blind bags, whereas "Lyra" is used by Hasbro affiliates more than once. Plus, conducting a Search Engine Test with "Lyra pony" versus "Heartstrings pony" makes it plainly obvious which is more popular (see this Google Insights graph, or these Google image searches and compare the results). Now, I'm not saying that the article be renamed, so the article you linked doesn't directly have any influence, here. However, it did prompt me to do a bit of testing via approved methods as to how popular the names are, so I will use that to further my case. As to the "Common Names" article, I think that it's strange that you would point me to that, seeing as it deals with article titles rather than the bold names in the first set of paragraphs.~Kyli* 08:23, November 21, 2011 (UTC)
Since you have almost a decade of experience editing wikis, you should know that user-edited sites cannot be cited. If you want to "document the fanbase" using sources that don't qualify as reliable sources, there are several other wikis that do that. –Throwawaytv 07:44, November 21, 2011 (UTC)
I agree that they are discouraged, but if you read Wikipedia's policy on reliable sources, and then consider that Know Your Meme requires an editor to have a verified account and, even then, articles require review by an employee, that site is reliable because it is third-party, published, has a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy, and is peer-reviewed. However, I agree that it is not the overall best source for information, so I won't try to argue that. Instead, I will restate the WeLoveFine source, as well as pose Equestria Daily as a source which is a "reliable, third-party, published [source] with a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy".
Sadly, though, I must temporarily leave that argument, as I have been up late enough to start hallucinating, misspelling, and using improper sentence structure. I will pick this up sometime later, but until then, this remains open. ~Kyli* 08:23, November 21, 2011 (UTC)

Discussion

If you ask a question and expect an answer, please raise the discussion somewhere that your question can be answered. –Throwawaytv 08:34, November 21, 2011 (UTC)

Infobox character

There is no guideline about header colors or sizes. Please use the style guide discussion to discuss one. When Shadowdemon said "We use the mane and coat colors for the headers" he probably meant "by convention", not "by guidelines". Legibility should take precedence over color choices, and the colors are approximate anyway. –Throwawaytv 08:34, November 21, 2011 (UTC)

Thank you ~Kyli* 22:58, November 21, 2011 (UTC)
I apologize for the confusion. Throw is right. When I said that, I meant overall it was used, not what was supposed to be used. Sorry for the confusion again. Lord of Shadows Words mean nothing! 23:23, November 21, 2011 (UTC)
That's fine, friend. ~Kyli* 23:25, November 21, 2011 (UTC)

"Bonbon" redirect

I don't see any point in Bonbon existing. Why should search engines find an incorrect spelling that is three degrees off of the current correct spelling (Bonbon --> Bon-Bon --> Bon Bon --> Sweetie Drops)? I haven't been around for as long as you have, but "Bon Bon" is the only official alternative name listed on her page so even "Bon-Bon" is of questionable usefulness and right to exist without any citations on her page of official sources using that spelling. So unless you have sources that use "Bonbon" (which should also be mentioned on her page), I will be deleting that page. Thanks, ~Bobogoobo (talk) 40?cb=20120702121758 09:23, December 23, 2012 (UTC)

Because the English and French word is "bonbon", so that's what people in general will search (using Google or the built-in Wiki search) for when looking for Bon-Bon. This leads them directly to the correct page rather than to a search for the correct page, which is not guaranteed to show the proper result. Redirects are not made for official names, but for similar names. For instance, if you search " Declaration of Independence" on Wikipedia, it does not bring you to a search page despite the fact that no Wikipedia page should have such a vague title. Instead, it brings you to the most popular Declaration of Independence: that of the United States. SO, too, should all wikis redirect probabilistic searches to the most likely page whenever possible. ~Supuhstar* 20:10, December 24, 2012 (UTC)
All right, I can see the logic in that, and since the redirect isn't harming anyone I suppose it can stay. I was just uncertain because we've discussed what is required for a redirect before and decided that we didn't want to make ones that are solely to help find things. They have to have some basis in official material. A search still puts Sweetie Drops at the top for "bonbon" anyway. But yeah, I guess it's fine. I'm curious now, though, since her page doesn't mention it: was there a point when she had an official name of "Bon-Bon" or was that just the first version of the fan-given name or something? Thanks for the reply. ~Bobogoobo (talk) 40?cb=20120702121758 09:00, December 26, 2012 (UTC)
You're welcome for the reply! As for your question about an official name, Yes and no. As far as I can tell, she's never been named in the show, but had a G1 version called Bon-Bon. ~Supuhstar* 03:57, December 28, 2012 (UTC)